00:00 The Essence of Irish Traditional Music Sessions
09:37 Engaging New Musicians and Session Etiquette
18:58 The Role of Mistakes in Music
28:08 Fostering a Positive Session Environment
34:23 Navigating Musical Etiquette in Sessions
36:08 The Dynamics of Playing with Friends
38:38 The Balance of Fun and Seriousness in Music
39:58 Embracing Mistakes and Humor in Performance
42:08 Understanding Session Traditions and Etiquette
45:41 The Role of Speed in Musical Sessions
49:37 Finding Balance Between Singers and Musicians
52:43 Identifying and Addressing Session Disruptions
58:35 Personal Growth Through Musical Expression
Conversational Transcript
*[This is an edited conversational transcript, lightly shaped for readability while keeping the spirit of the original conversation]
What does an Irish music session mean?
Tara:
Good morning, Damien Mullane.
Today we are talking to the accordion and melodeon player extraordinaire from London.
You are doing a lot of YouTube work at the minute. Are you doing a tune a day?
Damien:
No, just whenever I feel like it or have a tune in my head.
A lot of them come from lessons. We will be going through tunes, and at the end of the lesson I think, “I will just throw that tune up.”
I do not really plan it.
Tara:
I love the way you do it. You just go, “Fermoy Lasses.” There is a gruffness to it.
Damien:
There is nothing else to say.
We are talking rubbish, so just play the tune.
Tara:
I am going to start with the normal first question.
What does an Irish traditional music session mean to you?
Damien:
I suppose it is the access point for everyone.
It gives people an opportunity to join in and play, which you do not usually get in other genres of music.
In classical music, you either play the exact notes or you are not involved.
In jazz, you play all the wrong notes or you are not involved.
A session is a nice way of giving kids confidence that they can play and not feel intimidated by other musicians or by people listening.
It gives them time to express themselves with mistakes, because it is not being recorded in that sense.
It is a bit of freedom for any Irish musician. It is the reward for all the work they have been putting into their hobby.
It should be fun.
If you do all this hard work practising and then do nothing with it, the music becomes stagnant.
So a session is a great outlet for enjoying your hobby.
The session is not your time to shine
Tara:
That is what it is to others. But what does it mean to you?
Damien:
For me, when I used to go to sessions, it was not about taking over or trying to show off.
It was always: how can I add to this musical setting?
There is a typical thing where people say, “That was a shit session.”
If someone said that to me, my question would be: weren’t you in it?
That says to me that you were part of it and you did nothing to try to boost the musical experience for everyone.
If a session is ticking along nicely and someone comes in and adds to it, without taking over, the vibe rises.
That is what a session is about.
It teaches musicians how to join in rather than take over.
Playing tunes nobody knows, making it all about yourself, that is not the job.
If I am doing a session, I want everyone to be able to play the same amount.
I almost never play my own tunes in a session. It would be standards.
If you came to a session nervous, and one of your ten tunes was played, and the first tune was The Kesh Jig, suddenly you have a boost.
It might be a little faster than usual, but you get the feeling: I am part of this.
Then the person hosting the session becomes someone people trust. If I go to his session or her session, I will have a good tune.
The Kesh Jig or Sally Gardens are still here for a reason.
They can sound ten times better than you remember. They can still get the spark.
If you want to show off, get a gig.
There is a role you have when you are doing a session, and that is to get people involved.
It is not your time to shine.
Leading a session, not promoting a gig
Damien:
I remember being asked up into sessions when I was younger and getting the vibe from older musicians of, “How dare you come up and ask me?”
Then they would say, “This is actually an E-flat session.”
That happened to me as a kid.
I only had the B/C box, but I had a weird way of getting around the accordion, and I could play most of the tunes in E-flat.
Then the attitude changed. It became, “Oh, how are you doing all this?”
For me, it became clear it was not about who you were. It was about what you could do.
It was, “Show me what you can do, then we will accept you.”
That is not the session.
If you want a private gig, have a private gig.
If you are leading a session, lead the session.
Do not promote a gig.
Damien:
Years ago, Donogh Hennessy, the guitarist, did something I always found strange.
Even when we were playing in pubs in Dingle, he counted in.
At first I thought, “That is not a session thing.”
But if you really think about it, why not?
It is everyone together.
One, two, three, four, and straight into the tune.
Everyone is playing, and it sounds better.
Now I do it all the time.
It is not, “Have a listen to what I am doing here, and then join in if you can.”
It is, “We will play this, and everyone can join in.”
That creates a good vibe.
Starting tunes and bringing people in
Tara:
Counting in is a strange phenomenon for a session.
When I start a tune, I do not necessarily want to be shown off. I want the others to join in fairly soon.
A session is not the place for a solo.
Damien:
If I were regularly playing sessions, bringing in new tunes would be part of the ethos.
You play a tune, a few people get it that week, and next week everyone is in.
That is the rolling on of a session.
But I do not have that opportunity now because I do not go to regular sessions.
So when I go to a festival like the Patrick O’Keeffe Festival in Castleisland, I treat it slightly differently.
Everyone has come to play music.
So let us get everyone playing music.
If it is a weekly session with the same people, it would be weird if one person came in and started playing over everyone.
But at a festival, I try to get people involved because there is not that same continuation week to week.
Tara:
At a festival session, would you still count in?
Damien:
Absolutely.
It is fun.
Everyone is looking in, wondering what we are playing. Then we say, “We will play this.”
The kids are pumped, getting their fingers ready on the buttons for the tune they have practised.
We do not do it at mad speed. Just lively, with a little edge.
They come away thinking, “That was fast.”
Musical challenge in a session
Tara:
What turns Damien on in terms of musical challenge?
Do you keep that for the stage, or does it happen in sessions too?
Damien:
In a session, if someone plays a tune I do not know, I love that.
That is my opportunity to start thinking outside the melody.
Instead of trying to half-play loads of bad notes, I start thinking about chords and moving my hands. I lock into what the backers are doing.
Then, when I have an opportunity and I know where I am, I come back into the melody.
It doubles up the creativity.
Someone is playing for you, and you have to add to it.
Do not rush into a tune you do not know
Tara:
I love when someone plays a new tune and I think, “What is that?”
Damien:
What I find weird is when someone plays a new tune that you have never heard before, and you immediately start trying to play it.
It is like saying, “The two of us are going to say the exact same sentence at the exact same time for three minutes. Ready? Go.”
What are the odds we will say one word right?
Chill out and listen.
Give yourself an opportunity.
When someone is playing something new for the session, everyone benefits if they listen.
Tara:
That is why I sometimes go to the Patrick O’Keeffe Festival and do not sit into the session.
I would not know the tunes. I sit at the bar drooling because it is amazing.
Damien:
That is the thing about different counties around Ireland.
You never know what repertoire you will fit into.
Tara:
I love the idea of a session as the reward for the hobby.
Damien:
Everything should be fun.
If it is not fun, do not do it.
But you have to earn your reward as well.
Take the question of how many bodhrán players, guitar players or accompanists there should be.
One.
Logically, I cannot understand having loads.
If you have two guitar players who are not locked into each other, they are not playing the melody. They do not have that guide.
One thinks these are the chords, another thinks those are the chords, and suddenly you have two versions of backing going sideways.
It is like two people trying to say the same thing at the same time.
It becomes mush.
Same with bodhráns.
If one bodhrán player locks into the session, that is great. But you do not see multiple drum kits on stage unless the drummers know what they are doing.
On stage, it is rehearsed.
In a session, people have come from different places and different vibes. They do not know what the others are doing.
It just becomes mush.
Damien:
Who has done the most work?
The melody players have worked hard to learn those specific tunes.
So they get the most reward.
If you are the first accompanist in, or you have been asked to play, that is your reward too.
But you have done less work in that situation.
That might sound cruel, but the question is: do you want the session to sound good, or do you want to enforce your way in because you brought your bodhrán or guitar?
When someone says, “I brought my instrument and I am going to play, I do not care,” that takes away from the niceness of the session.
We do not all need participation trophies.
Sometimes you can relax and realise: I learned more from listening than I did from playing today.
If you cannot hum it, you do not know it
Tara:
I had a question recently from an intermediate player asking whether they should drone along or pick along with tunes.
My advice was probably not, unless you are guaranteed you can pick up the tune by the third time.
Otherwise you are not really listening to the whole tune. You are trying to pick out notes.
You might be better listening to the whole tune and getting it into your head.
Damien:
The question to ask is: if all this music stopped, could I hum the tune?
If you cannot hum the tune, you do not know the tune.
And that is okay.
Do not feel humiliated because you do not know something.
No one knows everything.
Tara:
Nobody came out of the womb knowing tunes.
Nobody is expecting anyone to be able to play along.
There is no embarrassment in having your instrument on your knee.
Damien:
When I was a kid, I would think, “God, I do not know that one.”
Then you imagine other people are looking at you.
But for me, it was the opposite. If I did not know the tune, I definitely would not play along.
I wanted to be able to hum it before I could play it.
Even now, although I can pick tunes up much quicker, I still need to have heard it a couple of times.
If I cannot hum it in my head, I do not know it.
Mistakes and the vibe check
Damien:
With my students, I do a vibe check to see how they relate to mistakes.
I give them a scenario.
You are in a session, playing loads of tunes. There are musicians you respect sitting at the bar listening.
You are playing, and you make a big mistake.
Everyone hears it.
You keep going, because that is what you are supposed to do.
Then I ask: how did you feel immediately?
The answers are all negative.
Embarrassed. Anxious. Wanting the floor to swallow you.
Then I ask: why?
It goes silent.
They do not really know why.
They say, “The people at the bar might have heard me.”
Then I ask, “What do you think they thought?”
They might say, “Maybe they felt sorry for me.”
So then we switch roles.
Now they are at the bar. Someone else is playing and makes a big mistake.
How do they feel?
And they say, “I do not care.”
So I say, “Get back in your seat.”
You have made yourself feel bad and pulled imaginary bad vibes from people who would never think that way.
If you are not making mistakes, you are not learning.
We have to learn to laugh at mistakes and move on.
Ninety-nine right, one wrong
Damien:
If you play a tune with a hundred notes and you make one mistake, what do people do?
They focus on the one mistake.
That is very Irish too.
You did ninety-nine right and one wrong, but you focus on the wrong one.
Put it into an exam.
One hundred questions. Ninety-nine right. One wrong.
How do you feel now?
Pretty good.
So why, in the thing you are supposed to enjoy, are you pulling all the negatives into it?
The pockets I like to play in are where I can be freer. I would rather be in the session than take over it.
Tara:
People think session hosts do not make mistakes.
We make mistakes all the time.
We just do not care.
If a newcomer or adult learner makes a mistake, they think, “God, I made a mistake.”
And?
Nobody cares.
Damien:
In every workshop, I ask, “Who is going to make mistakes today?”
At first people are hesitant.
Then everyone puts their hands up.
Then I ask, “Am I going to make mistakes?”
Absolutely.
So can we get rid of the whole thing where a mistake is treated like a shock?
You knew this was going to happen.
A mistake is not a disaster.
Tara:
Seán Maguire used to say, “Practice your mistakes.”
Practice everything, even how to get out of mistakes.
Damien:
It is freedom.
When writing tunes, I find it hard once I get comfortable in a key.
I have to shift because then I make new mistakes. That puts me down avenues I would not usually go.
Sometimes the mistake is where you needed to go.
Mistakes are where you find new avenues.
Tara:
And variations.
You hear someone else make a mistake and think, “I actually like that. I am going to try that next time.”
Damien:
I am always nicking my students’ mistakes.
The duty of the session host
Tara:
I love what you said about the duty of session hosts to make the session a more positive experience for everybody.
Damien:
It is about uplifting it.
A session is an occasion.
You are not guaranteed who will be there beyond the people booked or hosting.
You do not know what will happen.
So make the most of the opportunity, whether there are loads there or very few.
Find the right vibe for that night.
If I do a session that is advertised, I want kids and adults to know they can come in.
It is not, “Listen to me.”
The sessions in Castleisland are great because there are always so many people, and we are all having tunes together.
We play tunes everyone knows, like Jim Ward’s.
Tara:
Have you any challenges or rants related to session etiquette?
Damien:
The normal way to enter a session is simply to go up and ask.
But I never really took offence to anyone just sitting down and playing.
I am confident enough that I do not care what anyone thinks, but not everyone is like that.
For some people, it takes a lot just to get the fiddle out of the case and sit down.
If they have that one opportunity, that is one more than they would have had if they felt intimidated out of it because they did not ask.
They did not bring in a chainsaw.
They brought an instrument.
It is a weird setting for a lot of people.
Damien:
Adults pushing kids into sessions too early can be damaging for a child.
I remember playing a session with about twenty people. Ten steps away, there were four young lads, maybe seven, eight or ten years old, playing at the same time as us.
When we finished our set, we could hear they were playing a tune we had just played.
They could have joined in with us.
But the parents had a vision of getting the superstars out.
Those kids would have had so much more fun if they were joining in.
Bad guidance into sessions can be detrimental.
If a kid goes into a session and the parent is saying, “Go on, play,” it is embarrassing for the kid.
When adults were good to me as a young player, it was huge.
Karen Ryan in London gave me my first paid session gig in the Black Horse. She and others always got me involved.
That made me think: if you are an adult around kids in a session, give everyone a chance.
Remember when you were that young.
I love seeing the kids spark.
You always remember the ones who were not nice to you.
So do not be that adult around a child in a session.
A two-minute conversation with one person can change things.
There cannot be levels in a session.
You are there as a unit.
It does not carry value to be the king or queen of the session.
If you want that, get a gig.
Tara:
Do you think sessions need some architecture?
Maybe core hosts who are strong enough together to carry everybody?
Damien:
You need some kind of leader to carry the session and keep it going.
But if you are leading, I still believe it is your obligation to get everyone involved.
If you desperately want to have a tune for yourself, that is not tonight.
This has to be everyone involved.
What is the point of the session?
Everyone would like to have a tune.
Do you know all the tunes? No. Nobody does.
Are there common tunes we could all play? Yes.
Are there tunes I know that nobody else knows? Absolutely.
Which is the better option?
If I sit there and play by myself, or if I get everyone else involved and get that spark on the night?
It is my obligation not just to play and start every tune, but to give the nod now and then. Let someone else have it.
You might only do that twice in the night, because you still have to hold enough control that the session keeps moving.
Do not tailgate someone else’s set
Damien:
When someone starts a set of tunes, be aware that they have the power to end the tune.
It is not your opportunity to carry on with the next tune when there have already been four or five tunes and someone has finished the set.
Do not tail off the end of someone’s set and go straight into your tune.
Everyone has to come back up again and pull the vibe up again.
That is a mood killer.
If you desperately want to play that tune, start it yourself.
Do not finish on the end of someone else’s set.
Tara:
Would that be different at a festival?
Damien:
If it is an open session with no one hosting it, then it is a free-for-all.
If the tunes keep going, fine.
But if someone is hosting the session and trying to get everyone to play and keep the same vibe, then someone tagging on tunes at the end can kill it.
If someone suddenly starts a tune in E major and there is a whistle player sitting there, what are they going to do?
Tara:
What about sessions with friends?
If you are in a session with your best mates, what kind of etiquette is there?
Damien:
The person I play with most is Sean O’Meara, a guitarist.
If I am doing a session, it is often with him. It is just messing the whole time.
You are playing away and making each other laugh.
It is college.
There is so much giddiness there.
I also used to play with Jeremy Spencer, the fiddle player.
When we played together, we could play a bit rough around each other. Neither of us was fully locked into the tune in a rigid way.
Jeremy could play straight and give me freedom to mess with the bass, then he would do something.
That is fun.
If I am playing with Sean, I make a lot of mistakes on my left hand because we are messing around with the chordal structure.
The right hand is just going, keeping it moving.
For me, the fun is always from the backing.
Messing and musical comedy
Damien:
Your personality comes out when you are messing around.
I do not have the ability to be serious in soundchecks. I have to do something silly.
Phil Cunningham is one of the best I have ever seen at this.
I saw him do a gig years ago, and in one tune he played a B-flat where it should have been a B.
It sounded wrong, but he did it so bluntly and deliberately that it became the funniest thing ever.
At first people were thinking, “That is the wrong note.”
But then you realised he was showcasing the wrong note in a totally different fashion.
That made it fun.
Can you have that in a session?
Tara:
Can you have that in a session?
Damien:
You can if you do not give a flying fuck what anyone in the room thinks of you.
I have an amazing ability at that.
You can play wonky stuff because it is a social setting.
Not everyone knows what is going on, and you are not being paid to do anything.
Sometimes you are messing for reaction.
You might play something ridiculous, then look around the room and see someone laugh.
Then you are back into it.
Sometimes we need that.
Nothing matters. It is just for the fun of it.
The seriousness of it is horrible.
You have to have the games in it.
Damien:
In lessons, we have accordion battles.
It is very funny.
One student plays something, and I say to another, “Can you believe what he just said to you?”
Then they have to answer musically.
They are totally messing, but they are learning notes they would not usually use.
Subconsciously, they realise: that note is there if I want to go to that weird one.
Making mistakes is one of the best things.
I have absolute joy when mistakes happen because they are so funny.
Tara:
It is like a pressure valve has popped.
Damien:
On stage, we have the twenty-second rule.
If I make a bad mistake, I will not change facial expression. Neither will the others.
Twenty seconds later, we are laughing.
We never come off a gig saying, “Do you remember that cool bit we played?”
No.
We say, “Do you remember that banger of a mistake?”
That horrendous mistake we got around.
It is the human bodily reaction of thinking, “I am not coping here. This is hilarious. Where am I?”
If you can find humour in it, it is yours.
Music is supposed to be fun.
Red line and comfort zone
Tara:
One listener identifies as intermediate to advanced and struggles with playing up to the speed of sessions.
How would you advise people to get to that stage?
Damien:
I use what I call the red line and comfort zone.
If the session or recording is at this speed, I learn beyond that speed. I push a little bit further.
That upper speed is my red line.
Then the actual session speed becomes my comfort zone.
Use a metronome. Move it up.
You might hate it, and that is fine. But you will be more comfortable when you are playing at the speed of the session.
It does not mean I want to play as fast as I can.
It means that when I do play at speed, I am not under pressure because my red line is beyond it.
Tara:
What do you think about too many singers from the floor who are not playing in the session?
Damien:
You have to be fair.
It depends on the scenario. How many singers are there? How many melody players? What is the flow of the night?
There is a time and place for everything.
A slow air in the middle of everything can be lovely. It creates a vibe around the pub.
But you are in a pub. You are not in a place where people have paid specifically to hear you.
No one is obliged to do anything.
It is hard to say two sets of tunes, one song, two sets of tunes, one song. That gets too structured.
There are singing sessions where people can appreciate songs.
It should not feel like the musicians are forced to sit and wait for the song to finish.
There should be some crossover where everyone can work together.
Damien:
How many musicians really play for sean-nós singers?
There are few.
Sean-nós singing is melodic. There is so much in it. You can put colour into it.
It is often treated as a bland insert where everyone goes silent.
Tara:
A lot of sean-nós singers would prefer no musicians playing along. Sometimes they want to sing by themselves.
Damien:
Do you know where you can do that?
At a gig.
Get your own gig.
If you are self-entitled enough to say, “I want this moment to be about me,” get your own gig.
In a session, you are the same as everyone else.
The kid sitting there is the same as the adult. The bodhrán player is the same as the person singing.
You cannot have values over others.
What you want and what everyone else wants has to come together.
No one is king of that emotion at that point.
Tara:
How do you deal with session wreckers, and how do you identify if you are that person?
Damien:
First, you have to define whether the person is wrecking the session.
Usually, it is someone with no knowledge of what they are doing.
Maybe someone who has never been to a session before, bought an instrument, and suddenly wants to join in.
But if they are very quiet and you cannot hear them, I would not call them a session wrecker.
Spoons, glasses, bottles, noisemakers, those can be session wreckers.
If we stopped everything and you continued doing that for ten minutes, how do you think everyone would feel?
If we picked one musician from the session and made them play for ten minutes, what do you think people would rather hear?
You have to know that what you are doing is not helping.
You are not the main character.
We are all the cast, trying to make this better.
You are coming in and smashing over everything, thinking, “Isn’t this great?”
It was great before you started.
Damien:
Not everyone wants to be honest because it is seen as rude.
But how else do you say, “Can you stop doing that? It is affecting everyone.”
As the session host, you have to be that person for the good of the whole session.
I have told people to stop.
I do not have a problem with it.
I am not trying to fight them, but they need to come back into the room and realise there are other people around them.
Volume and responsibility
Damien:
Are you playing so much noise that you cannot hear what is going on around you?
Because if you cannot hear it, how is anyone else supposed to?
Be aware of your surroundings.
I would never fight in a session to get the top volume. There is no point.
It ruins the overall sound.
You just get soloists pumping their instruments, putting them out of tune.
With volume comes responsibility.
If you are loud and playing all different things around the tune, that is different from playing the melody strongly and pushing the session.
You would not play harmony louder than the original melody.
If you are loud and outside the tune, you are not getting involved. You are taking over.
Tara:
I do play loudly in sessions sometimes, but often it is to help others so they do not feel exposed.
Damien:
That is different.
If there are lots of people playing, someone needs to hold the timing.
The timing is very important.
Not caring what people think
Tara:
The mystery question from the last guest is:
In your musical career, have you ever made a creative or career decision that felt wrong at the time, but later turned out to be exactly what you needed?
Damien:
Stop giving a shit what other people think.
You get abuse all the time.
Even now, people feel the need to get into the comments.
People will talk shit about you all the time.
If they see you doing something that is not what they want you to do, they will try to make you feel bad for it.
Music is very personal when you put it out there, so when people criticise it, it goes right to you.
But over time, I learned: fuck the lot of them.
Let them say what they want.
I have continued playing my music, not caring what they think.
If you are trying to be yourself in your music, you will get shit.
But take the risk.
It is worth it because you will enjoy your music.
The one person who hears your music one hundred percent of the time is you.
Why would you cater for everyone else?
Tara:
I think we all go through a phase where we think we are supposed to play this or that.
Then at some point you realise you are not playing what is true to you anymore.
You take time out, reassess, and come back doing it for yourself.
Damien:
Absolutely.
That does not mean saying, “I am going to do what I want and play over everyone.”
It means I am going to do what I do, regardless of what you say.
But if I am playing with other people, I am well aware that I am joining in, not enforcing.
People will create narratives about you.
“He plays really fast.”
Yes. Correct.
They might see it as an insult. I see it as a joke.
The biggest plus for me musically was focusing on myself, not others.
Damien Mullane’s episode cuts through a lot of politeness and gets straight to the point.
A session is not a private stage.
It is not the place to prove that you are brilliant, play every obscure tune you know, or demand that the room bends around you.
For Damien, the role of a session host is to raise the whole room. That does not mean lowering standards. It means choosing the right tunes, holding the timing, reading the night, giving people a way in, and making the music feel better because everyone is involved.
His question is a hard one:
If you thought the session was bad, what did you do to improve it?
That question puts responsibility back where it belongs.
Not only on the host. Not only on the newcomer. Not only on the loud player, the singer, the bodhrán player or the listener.
On everyone in the room.
Damien is also very clear that fun matters. Mistakes are not disasters. They are part of the music, part of learning, part of the social release that makes sessions human. A mistake can wreck your confidence if you turn it into shame. Or it can become a joke, a variation, a new direction, even a way into your own style.
That is one of the useful contradictions in this conversation.
The session needs discipline, but it also needs play.
It needs responsibility, but not stiffness.
It needs leadership, but not ego.
It needs standards, but not humiliation.
Damien’s strongest advice may be that volume, ability and confidence all carry responsibility. If you can lead, lead generously. If you can play loud, hold the tune and timing for others. If you are hosting, get people involved. If you are joining, do not enforce yourself on the room.
And if you want the session to be better, become part of making it better.
*Produced & recorded by Tara Connaghan and edited by Anita Alvarez Santos
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